Category: Let's talk
This is not meant to stir up any political debate, though I'll answer any questions you may have on my end. I'm just curious. So here are a few questions I thought of after reading the "What Would You DO" post. These questions are meant for everyone, regardless of their country. Some of these questions may be a little crazy, but it's an even dozen.
1. Does being a citizen of your country make you proud?
I wouldn't say I'm proud to be an American citizen, but I guess it has some perks. lol Becoming a Greek citizen is a lifetime ambition.
2. Do you stand for the national anthem?
I always stand for the Greek one, whether alone or in public and sometimes put it on when I'm feeling extra patriotic just because. I stand for the American one in public, mostly cause people tell me to.
3. Do you know all the words to the national anthem?
I'm still learning them. I hope to be able to sing it on Independence Day next year. I know the American one from being taught/hearing it.
4. Do you wear or display any signs of patriotism, flags, shirt that says your nationality, your national colours?
I always wear a Greek flag pin on my clothing. I also have three small flags in my room and a 3 ft by 5 ft (sorry, don't know metric yet) one that I like to display out my window when the weather's decent and I like buying blue or blue and white things in general, even though I can't see them.
5. Do you have any patriotic heroes that you like?
Of course, I like those from the War of Independence, but there's this one man. He was an evzone (the soldiers who gard the flag) in his late teens/early twenties. During World War II, when the Nazis came and wanted to put up their flag, he wrapped himself in the Greek flag and jumped to his death off the Acropolis in order to prevent the Germans from taking down the Greek flag. Ten days later, two men took theirs down, and they're remembered witha monument, but this one evzone isn't and that upsets me.
6. Do you celebrate any patriotic holidays?
We only have two, Oxi Day on the 28th of October, to celebrate saying no to the Italians invading us in WWII and Independence Day on the 25th of March, to celebrate our independence from the Ottoman Empire. I celebrate both, but love the second one the best. I do not celebrate any American patriotic holidays.
7. Would you join the military if you could? (If your country requires it's itizens or some of them to join, think would you if you had a choice?)
I'd definitely join the Hellenic military if I was a citizen and knew the language fluently, even if it was just to answer the phones.
8. If you have children or plan on doing so, do you want them to feel a sense of pride for their country?
Yes, I want my children, should I have any, to be born in Greece, even if we don't get to live there due to finances etc. I definitely want them to be patriotic.
9. Would you lay down your life for your country if the cause was reasonable? What about helping it out in times of need?
Yes, most definitely and I'd also help if I could.
10. Do you wish you were born somewhere else? If so, where?
Greece, of course... Actually, no. Being born in America made me appreciate everything Greek. It also made me see our flaws... You could be a patriot and speak the truth.
11. Do you or would you vote and/or get involved in politics as a spectator?
I do, but only cause I feel it my duty to the polis/state as a Hellenic Polytheist and I want to make things good for me while I'm here. I would if I were a Greek citizen. I only involve myself in the American political issues that seriously matter to me. I involve myself in alot of Greek stuff, even to the point of checking out the different parties before the election and cheering when mine got seats.
12. What do you think of people burning the flag of your country?
No one had better burn a Greek flag around me, I'll say that much! As for the American, I'm on the fence. Part of me says no, just cause it's disrespectful and part really doesn't care one way or the other.
1. Does being a citizen of your country make you proud?
Yes, with everything I have. When I play Taps, I do it to serve my country, and I have dedicated the rest of my life to America's veterans by working for the VA.
2. Do you stand for the national anthem?
Yes, I stand at attention, and I play it.
3. Do you know all the words to the national anthem?
Well, no, I usually play it.
4. Do you wear or display any signs of patriotism, flags, shirt that says your nationality, your national colours?
I have a corps jacket that has our logo and Duty, Honor, Country and the American Flag.
5. Do you have any patriotic heroes that you like?
All those who have and are serving in the Armed Forces.
6. Do you celebrate any patriotic holidays?
I march in all national holiday parades.
7. Would you join the military if you could? (If your country requires it's itizens or some of them to join, think would you if you had a choice?)
In a heartbeat!
8. If you have children or plan on doing so, do you want them to feel a sense of pride for their country?
yes
9. Would you lay down your life for your country if the cause was reasonable? What about helping it out in times of need?
I'd give my life anytime.
10. Do you wish you were born somewhere else? If so, where?
No, this is the best place in the world!
11. Do you or would you vote and/or get involved in politics as a spectator?
Yes, I vote in every election and think that those who don't vote have no right to complain about how things are run.
12. What do you think of people burning the flag of your country?
I think they should be put in front of a military firing squad and then have their bodies burned.
1. Does being a citizen of your country make you proud?
No. Even if I believed in the idea of American exceptionalism, I wouldn't feel proud of being born here, because I can only take pride in those things that I have accomplished.
2. Do you stand for the national anthem?
No.
3. Do you know all the words to the national anthem?
No.
4. Do you wear or display any signs of patriotism, flags, shirt that says your nationality,
your national colours?
Never.
5. Do you have any patriotic heroes that you like?
No.
6. Do you celebrate any patriotic holidays?
No.
7. Would you join the military if you could? (If your country requires it's itizens
or some of them to join, think would you if you had a choice?)
I would fight to defend the country from attack, but I would never fight to support the idea that America should dictate to the rest of the world.
8. If you have children or plan on doing so, do you want them to feel a sense of
pride for their country?
No.
9. Would you lay down your life for your country if the cause was reasonable? What
about helping it out in times of need?
I would lay down my life to defend the principles I believe in, such as intellectual freedom or the survival of civilization, but it would have nothing to do with nationalism.
10. Do you wish you were born somewhere else? If so, where?
I don't know.
11. Do you or would you vote and/or get involved in politics as a spectator?
I have voted regularly ever since I was eligible to vote, and I have always taken a strong interest in political issues, but it is becoming increasingly difficult for me to participate in our deteriorating political system. Who is there to vote for any more?
12. What do you think of people burning the flag of your country?
It is not a form of expression that I would use personally, since it only offends people and does not convince anyone of anything, but I have no particular hang-up about it. It's just a goddam piece of cloth.
1. Does being a citizen of your country make you proud?
Yes, to some extent, however this doesnot assume (like the Americans seem to think) I think it's the greatest and best country on earth, but it's my country (Iceland that is).
2. Do you stand for the national anthem?
Yes, both mine and other nations, basic respect.
3. Do you know all the words to the national anthem?
Yes.
4. Do you wear or display any signs of patriotism, flags, shirt that says your nationality,
your national colours?
Occasionally a shirt that says "I'm Icelandic, what's your excuse?"
5. Do you have any patriotic heroes that you like?
Those 9th century vikings who chopped off heads and used them to play ice hockey are somewhat lovable, in a cartoonish sort of way.
6. Do you celebrate any patriotic holidays?
Independence day (June 17th) fun parades, loads of parties, cotton candy.
7. Would you join the military if you could? (If your country requires it's itizens
or some of them to join, think would you if you had a choice?)
No, not unless, as reclusive thinker said, my country was under attack (note, it does not mean going out there and killing everyone you think may be a threat, that's not self defense).
8. If you have children or plan on doing so, do you want them to feel a sense of
pride for their country?
Certainly, but they should also learn what's special about other places.
9. Would you lay down your life for your country if the cause was reasonable? What
about helping it out in times of need?
I'd lay down my life if my family was threatened and possibly if country was invaded, but not just as a matter of principal.
10. Do you wish you were born somewhere else? If so, where?
No, one can make it anywhere one wants to.
11. Do you or would you vote and/or get involved in politics as a spectator?
Not really, politicians are all the same, ahven't found anyone who not only promises change but then follows through with it. Not voting is also a sign of expression, it means none of the candidates are promoting your ideals or you don't trust them to do so if ellected, so it is as much an opinion as voting.
12. What do you think of people burning the flag of your country?
It's rather silly, almost as annoying as people who think their country is is better than anyone else's.
1. Does being a citizen of your country make you proud?
I'm not proud to be Swiss. I consider myself lucky, sure, and I feel an affinity for the place and everything that goes with it (I'll always go for Switzerland during sports events, for example). I also feel a certain amount of duty toward Switzerland on the basis of being one of its products (see the military question). However, I didn't do anything to be Swiss, so I think pride would be misplaced.
2. Do you stand for the national anthem?
We don't do that in Switzerland. However, if I'm somewhere where standing for the respective national anthem is the custom, of course I will stand.
3. Do you know all the words to the national anthem?
First verse, yes. Subsequent ones, no.
4. Do you wear or display any signs of patriotism, flags, shirt that says your nationality,
your national colours?
No, unless it's done in a joking way--I do have a hot water bottle with a Swiss flag on it!
5. Do you have any patriotic heroes that you like?
Oh, sure. Many heroic deeds have been committed in the name of Switzerland (as in the name of many countries), and I would call those who committed them heroes. Not because they are Swiss, but because they did what they did.
6. Do you celebrate any patriotic holidays?
Absolutely. Hey, it's a holiday :-). The Swiss national holiday is August 1, and it's a huge day- (and night-) long celebration. Lots of fun.
7. Would you join the military if you could? (If your country requires it's itizens
or some of them to join, think would you if you had a choice?)
Nope. The Swiss military is outdated and ineffectual, and simply not worth the effort. I would be willing, however, to do my part in the case of unjustified attack. I *am* Swiss, after all.
8. If you have children or plan on doing so, do you want them to feel a sense of
pride for their country?
Again, not pride, but appreciation and belonging, certainly.
9. Would you lay down your life for your country if the cause was reasonable? What
about helping it out in times of need?
That depends on how you define "country". For a bunch of rock and numbered bank accounts? Nope. To protect the people who live there and about whom I care? I don't know if I'd lay down my life (unless these people included my son and/or my husband), but I certainly would help out.
10. Do you wish you were born somewhere else? If so, where?
No. I'm lucky.
11. Do you or would you vote and/or get involved in politics as a spectator?
No. I'm not interested in politics, and too lazy to keep up with it anyway.
12. What do you think of people burning the flag of your country?
I really don't see the point, but hey, it doesn't particularly bother me either. It's just a piece of cloth.
Oh you think the flag is just a piece of cloth do you? So then, do you think soldiers are just nothing too?! You have no idea what freedom costs, do you!
Well, there is the print, a flag is not just a piece of cloth, it has pretty colors on it, and a bunch of stars for some countries, yes, yes, I can see how it's more than a piece of cloth.
The idea of military power and soldiers being the key to world peace is rather ridiculous really. And, well, soldiers know what they are signing up for when they join the army, they can get killed in the process, it's a conscious choice they make, I have much more sympathy for the innocent people who get killed by them than for the soldiers themselves. You have no idea what it is to be bullied around by a military power in the name of freedom (and it's always its own freedom), do you?
Can you imagine how many more young people will live and how much happier everyone would be if the U.S. used may be a tenth of the money spent on their killing machine development on things like cheaper drugs or better healthcare for all.
Thank you, thank you, Wildebrew, I completely forgot about the print! :-)
DrumCorps-and-so-on-and-so-forth, actually, my point was supposed to be that you can burn a flag, but you can't burn what makes a country special to its inhabitants. So, it doesn't hurt me when someone burns a Swiss flag--what matters is still there and can't be burned, so we're good.
The way you lash out at me illustrates *exactly* in what way flags can become a dangerous symbol. Basically, a country's leaders can take the flag and convinced gullible simple-minded people like you that it stands for honor and glory and all that shite. They'll then gladly go out, eager to die for these abstract concepts, when really what they are dying for is their leader's personal interests that have *nothing* to do with either honor or glory. So, no, I don't think soldiers are nothing. I think they are the victims of a scam, and I feel bad that so many mother's sons and children's fathers and women's husbands are dying for a big huge scam.
As for the price of freedom--again, I don't see what that has to do with a flag. Presumably, you are trying to say that the US soldiers are fighting for the flag, and thus for freedom. Last time i checked, no one was trying to invade the States. It was the other way around--I guess only *your* freedom is worth something? Besides, dear, it doesn't seem to me you have all that much freedom--have you noticed the ridiculous strictness of drug laws in the US recently, for example?
Don't get me wrong. The US is a fine country, and I'm positively sickened by the waste of life in Iraq, military and civilian. But I think you are acting like a brain-washed little suicide-bomber in training--it sounds as if the US ever resorted to that kind of strategy, you'd be the first to sign up. This really scares me, and I'm glad that you so far do nothing more dangerous than bang on drums!
No, my corps does not condone violence. We play for the veterans that have gone to war. The war is in Iraq. We just play Taps for the vets. And no, I am not brainwashed. You might be though.
How stupid of me. From everything you said I assumed that if I so much as failed to drop to my knees in front of your flag, you'd gladly have me invaded in the name of freedom. (That's sarcasm, by the way).
As for being brainwashed--I guess we're all brainwashed. What differs is who we let brainwash us.
Debate of the flag asside, I found all of your answers very interesting, and I was glad to learn a few things about different cultures. For example, I thought that most Western countries stood for their national anthem. I think the comments about pride versus appreciation for being born in a country were also interesting, and though I still hold to my beliefs, I can certainly see the logic in the other viewpoint. I actually kind of live it, since the country I'm proud of is not that of my birth. I also understand the view that you wouldn't just go and fight for one reason or another, especially if you found it to be wrong and dishonorable. But I must say one thing about leaders etc. If I were to defend my country, it wouldn't be because of a particular leader and what they wanted me to think. It would be for the country, the culture, the people and the situation surrounding the need for defence. If I were to serve in peacetime, then it would be for myself, to know that I did something for the country I love. As for whether the land means anything to me, yes it does. Thousands of years of history and culture, blood spilt in the name of freedom, the birth of Western civilisation (whether it's a good thing or not is not the point) and my religion was born there. Hypothetically, people from Greece could start a space colony and call it by the same name, but I think there would always be that sense of what it's namesake means, how it came to be, and although the new colony would eventually develop it's own history and traditions, the old would still remain to some degree. That's probably true for other countries as well, which is why many immigrants hold on to their traditions and even some of their children try to keep some, though not all and not always.